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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeMar 23rd 2010
     
    Posted By: joshs
    Posted By: TrimI think old fashioned thermally driven evaporation is likely more efficient than PV driven R/O.

    Talk about strawmen where does PV driven R/O come in? Evaporating water takes a load of energy even under partial pressure compared to removing NH3 and CO2 so that it can be recycled as a concentrated draw fluid. It main purpose would be to desalinate seawater however freshwater that has been raised up by a membrane has loads of PE which would be silly not to make use of. Solar energy (if needed) would be used to warm the used draw fluid under partial pressure to drive off NH3 and CO2 so it can be reused to desalinate more seawater waste heat can also be used for this if available. The PE of raised water is one way of generating electricity, however the Dutch and Italians have invented separate devices that can use the different electrical states between fresh and saline water to produce electricity. More efficiency is needed know. Unfortunately I am to dumb to know if similar devices would work with ammonia type fluid and fresh water. However if a reason ever arose, than fresh water that has used up it PE could be "resalinated" in a Dutch or Italian device to produce more electricity.
    You want to poison estuaries with ammonium hydroxide do you?


    It's a closed distillation system. It's actually quite a neat idea.

    Your comment about reconcentrating brine by thermal evaporation is right on target.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 23rd 2010
     
    You want to poison estuaries with ammonium hydroxide do you?

    Angus is right it is a closed distillation system, however what to do with the concentrated brine might be a problem.

    @Angus

    Are you less dumb then me? Do you think a fluid "desire" to "even out" like fresh and saline water which can be utilised to produce electricity (inefficiently at the moment) could apply to a strong and weak ammonia fluid?
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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeMar 23rd 2010
     
    I would never admit to being less dumb than anybody.

    I think so, in several ways. For example, the "concentration cell".

    As far as I know you can get osmotic pressure between any two solutions of differing strength, if you have a suitable membrane.

    BTW the salt water counterpart to the ammonium carbamide storage system can completely contain the salt. The two systems appear to differ primarily in the expected performance of membranes, which, however, have not been developed yet.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 23rd 2010
     
    Well you are certainly less dumb then me,thanks.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010 edited
     
    Source ACS Publications

    This might interest you Angus it took me long enough to find it.Its a year old.
    You now have to pay to get full article.

    Superhydrophobic Membranes with Ordered Arrays of Nanospiked Microchannels for Water Desalination
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    A free PDF paper about Superhydrophobic glass, hope you can understand it.

    http://www.ccsenet.org/journal/index.php/mas/article/viewFile/5090/4256
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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    Posted By: TrimSource ACS Publications

    This might interest you Angus it took me long enough to find it.Its a year old.
    You now have to pay to get full article.

    Superhydrophobic Membranes with Ordered Arrays of Nanospiked Microchannels for Water Desalination


    Thanks - I am quite interested. Can you suggest a way I can get it without paying? They don't call me Angus for nothing. (Actually they don't call me Angus at all, but that's another story.)
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      CommentAuthormisterfish
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    Posted By: Angus(Actually they don't call me Angus at all, but that's another story.)


    So that`s not really you in the photo then??
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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010 edited
     
    Posted By: misterfish
    Posted By: Angus(Actually they don't call me Angus at all, but that's another story.)


    So that`s not really you in the photo then??


    I reserve comment until I see the photo - or are you referring to Sean, the Free-Energy Pigasus up there in the corner?
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    Angus are you a member of the AAAS or a member of the IEEE, I'm not so can't get hold of free or cheap articles.
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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    Posted By: TrimAngus are you a member of the AAAS or a member of the IEEE, I'm not so can't get hold of free or cheap articles.


    SM IEEE. I'll check. I thought maybe you had a copy on hand.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    Trouble with old copies they either go 404 or want payment. And my file system needs a lot of improvement.
  1.  
    Posted By: TrimTrouble with old copies they either go 404 or want payment.


    ... or they suddenly clamp down on the security. Has happened to me a couple times on university sites. Stuff that was freely accessible at one point later becomes unreachable without a uni account.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeMar 24th 2010
     
    Nuisance isn't it?
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeApr 6th 2010
     
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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeApr 6th 2010
     
    Posted By: TrimSource Physorg

    New membrane

    Hold the salt: Engineers develop revolutionary new desalination membrane


    Good one.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2010
     
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      CommentAuthoraber0der
    • CommentTimeJun 9th 2010
     
    Good news, but a little too late.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeJul 19th 2010
     
    Latest news from New Scientist

    A salty solution for power generation
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      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeJul 20th 2010
     
    Interesting. I was not aware of Hamelers. His approach seems similar to one that was published out of Italy last year.