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    • CommentAuthorTesl01D
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    I for one have never been interested in the know-nothing Steorn skeptics. Dime-a-dozen, really. And barely interested for that matter in the *real* skeptics, who have a point or two or three about the Orbo... Me, I've always assumed -- reasonably -- that Steorn yes indeedy has *something* very important going here; the only question being: just what, exactly..?

    And so I ask you all: what is this phenomenon Steorn calls "Orbo"? What does it imply about Reality, and our understanding of physics? And yes (as has already been broached): what _does_ this mean for the political-economy -- and the future -- of the planet..?
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      CommentAuthorping1400
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    plant
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    It depends on

    1) If it works.
    2) How much power does it produce.
    3) How much will it cost.
  1.  
    The phenomenon is called gullibility. What it implies about reality, is that many people lack the skills to best determine what is and what isn't real. It says that our understanding of physics, while not accurate in the big picture yet, has at least given us some axioms that can't be discarded out of wishful thinking or bad reasoning. For the economy, it means that scammers and frauds will always be able to make some money. As for your last question, the planet will go on as it has in the past.
  2.  
    If it does as they claim and puts out more energy than in, it will take some time to fully understand what is really going on over the rhetoric they have been spewing.

    Again on the if: then some thing could be done with the ideas and truly become a tech field that might cause change in the world.

    Yet I am a skeptic, the rhetoric is a problem. As stated it could not work. Yet to be fair, the whole game has been to get folks to present ideas and ways of doing some thing with what ever they believe they have. In that aspect I see this whole thing as a most interesting method of operation.
    A demo is not proof of some thing, it still will be seen as a claim of some thing, until verified and replicated by others.
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      CommentAuthorskeptical
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    Makes as much sense as discussing what Santa's reindeer powered sleigh will mean for the future of air travel.
    • CommentAuthorSPECTRE
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    Posted By: evolvealreadyThe phenomenon is called gullibility. What it implies about reality, is that many people lack the skills to best determine what is and what isn't real. It says that our understanding of physics, while not accurate in the big picture yet, has at least given us some axioms that can't be discarded out of wishful thinking or bad reasoning. For the economy, it means that scammers and frauds will always be able to make some money. As for your last question, the planet will go on as it has in the past.


    Agreed and well said.
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      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    Wrong, Trim. The importance of Steorn only depends on whether "it works". How much power it produces and how much it costs are trivial considerations compared to the possibility of having to rewrite essentially all of modern physics and the assumptions underlying it.
    • CommentAuthorAtom
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    [quote][cite]Posted By: maryyugo[/cite]Wrong, Trim. The importance of Steorn only depends on whether "it works". How much power it produces and how much it costs are trivial considerations compared to the possibility of having to rewrite essentially all of modern physics and the assumptions underlying it.[/quote]

    Quite so, it would be the start of a journey, not the end.
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      CommentAuthorTrim
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    Be serious if appears to be working tomorrow than we have to take seriously for a change. If it supply's really useful amounts of power it will be godsend to the space industry at the very least. Proxima Centauri here we come.
  3.  
    Posted By: TrimBe serious if appears to be working tomorrow than we have to take seriously for a change. If it supply's really useful amounts of power it will be godsend to the space industry at the very least. Proxima Centauri here we come.
    If it appears to be working tomorrow, we need to look harder.
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      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    Exactly. On TV, Teller appears to shoot Penn and Penn appears to catch the bullet with his teeth. Don't try it at home.
    • CommentAuthorTesl01D
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009 edited
     
    Posted By: TrimIt depends on

    1) If it works.
    2) How much power does it produce.
    3) How much will it cost.


    Ya. All that, and more.
    I assume:

    1) It indeed works. Whatever the hell it is.
    2) As they've said many times: it *scales* -- i.e. to *monstrous* size. Any size you want.
    3) It will ultimately cost ZERO. But when that will be is anyone's guess at this point.
    • CommentAuthorTesl01D
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009 edited
     
    Posted By: evolvealreadyThe phenomenon is called gullibility. What it implies about reality, is that many people lack the skills to best determine what is and what isn't real. It says that our understanding of physics, while not accurate in the big picture yet, has at least given us some axioms that can't be discarded out of wishful thinking or bad reasoning. For the economy, it means that scammers and frauds will always be able to make some money. As for your last question, the planet will go on as it has in the past.


    I would file this one under "know-nothing skeptic". You think you're making a case here -- but you're really not. You are assuming, for one thing, that Steorn is a complete fraud. And that, it *cannot* be. The worst would be that Steorn are all 'pathologically deluded' -- but *who* has proved _that_ possibility, pray tell..?
    • CommentAuthormensor
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    All of a sudden we seem to be inundated with believers...
    • CommentAuthorTesl01D
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009 edited
     
    Posted By: lostcauses10xA demo is not proof of some thing, it still will be seen as a claim of some thing, until verified and replicated by others.

    I think a successful demo is proof enough. Rigorous proof, OTOH, is another thing entirely. But you don't have to have a full theory of anything to just make something work, you know. Just to understand WHY it works -- and to extend it to something even better, perhaps.
  4.  
    Posted By: Tesl01D
    Posted By: evolvealreadyThe phenomenon is called gullibility. What it implies about reality, is that many people lack the skills to best determine what is and what isn't real. It says that our understanding of physics, while not accurate in the big picture yet, has at least given us some axioms that can't be discarded out of wishful thinking or bad reasoning. For the economy, it means that scammers and frauds will always be able to make some money. As for your last question, the planet will go on as it has in the past.


    I would file this one under "know-nothing skeptic". You think you're making a case here -- but you're really not. You are assuming, for one thing, that Steorn is a complete fraud. And that, it *cannot* be. The worst would be that Steorn are all 'pathologically deluded' -- but *who* has proved _that_ possibility, pray tell..?
    If you were familiar with the basics of critical thinking, you would realize that disbelief in such a claim is the rational default position when no adequate evidence has been given...even IF the company had not totally discredited itself like Steorn has.
    We are all know-nothings. Some of us know what being allowed to nothing about such a claim means.
    • CommentAuthorFishtown
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    @Tesl01D- you must know that the burden of claims is on the claimant. And the burden of fantastic claims even more so. Skeptics are given the privilege of their position by the virtue of requiring proof, which has not been given. Worse, it has been promised and evaded again and again.

    These are not close-minded people. They wouldn't be here otherwise. They demand what science demands- proof. Even small proof, something. But, thus far it has all been vapor.

    But let us see what tomorrow brings. what can Steorn materialize for three years in the magnet mines?
    • CommentAuthorefend
    • CommentTimeDec 14th 2009
     
    I would love for there to be a free energy technology. Steorn however has not provided a shred of evidence to support this. its all sean says so. I could just as easily claim I have a flying pink unicorn, and you should just take my word for it, because "i said so". Clearly, an invention is worthless unless someone can actually prove that it works and actually allow others to put it to practical use. What good is Steorns invention if it cannot use it to accomplish anything except hallow promises? Obviously the idea of waiting and waiting for this is ridiculous, youll be waiting for the rest of your life for Steorns miraculous technology, otherwise eventually you have to acknowledge that they have nothing. If they really did have it, proving it would have been something they could have done back in 2006. It is their responsibility to prove this claim and making claims like this and then refusing to provide any evidence to back it up is completely unethical.

    If you have a technology that would save millions of lives, what kind of people would sit on it for 3 years and act in the most rude, offensive and arrogant ways for people who are asking where this wonderful technology is?
  5.  
    I think we will learn a lot about skeptics by the way they approach the situation tomorrow if we truly see a spinning disk. And how far off will the estimates be?

    I think it's a "journey above destination"-thing - and seeing the different skeptics explode with the razor-edge explanations that will all be mutually exclusive - combined with a smug certainty. The best social porn ever.