Vanilla 1.1.9 is a product of Lussumo. More Information: Documentation, Community Support.

    • CommentAuthorjoshs
    • CommentTimeAug 23rd 2014
     
    It's the Clinton One.
    • CommentAuthorloreman
    • CommentTimeAug 25th 2014
     
  1.  
  2.  
    oops. bloody whale again. rip, granny.
  3.  
    Inter Continental Ballistic Business Class
    •  
      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2014 edited
     
    Looks as if there has been another depressurization accident. Fighter jets reported the windows frosted and the pilots slumped over before the plane crashed on Jamaica.

    http://www.13wham.com/news/features/top-stories/stories/f15-fighters-trailing-jet-over-atlantic-15433.shtml

    Hmmm... I wonder if their aircraft maintenance had complied with this AD:

    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2009-11-13/pdf/E9-27321.pdf
    •  
      CommentAuthoralsetalokin
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2014 edited
     
    There is so much that can go wrong with your oxygen at those altitudes that people really should be trained in an altitude chamber before piloting along up there. Sudden hypoxia isn't like holding your breath, it's more like being hit in the head with a sledgehammer, or being given an IV general anaesthetic. At 25 thousand feet, if you depressurize you will be _out_ in thirty or 40 seconds.

    ETA: Single engine, single pilot, no supplemental oxygen but relying on pressurization, and over water. What could possibly go wrong?
    •  
      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeSep 5th 2014
     
    Posted By: alsetalokinAt 25 thousand feet, if you depressurize you will be _out_ in thirty or 40 seconds.
    If you don't breathe. Perhaps quicker if you do because it washes out the oxygen in your lungs.
    •  
      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014
     
    Posted By: maryyugowashes out the oxygen in your lungs.


    In your blood, you mean. Gas exchange goes into reverse.
    •  
      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014 edited
     
    Posted By: Angus
    Posted By: maryyugowashes out the oxygen in your lungs.


    In your blood, you mean. Gas exchange goes into reverse.
    It ends up involving blood, right. Via the lungs. And yes, oxygen exchange starts to go from the blood to the air as the partial pressure of oxygen decreases in the air causing disassociation of oxyhemoglobin. Phhhewwww. Actually I meant lungs. That's where the washout starts.
    •  
      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014
     
    Not to be a nitpicker (ha), but the lungs are full of gas. It will be exchanged with the ambient gas when you breathe. The ambient gas composition is the same as at sea level, but the overall pressure is weaker. So I don't see any unusual process happening in the lungs except that the oxygen is being pulled out of the blood rather than pulled in. So the washout is from your blood.
  4.  
    Posted By: AngusNot to be a nitpicker (ha), but the lungs are full of gas.

    Disasterous otherwise, pitnicker.
    •  
      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014
     
    True, but irrelevant to the discussion, repitnick.
    • CommentAuthorLakes
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014
     
    No need to get your pitnickers in a twist.
    • CommentAuthortinker
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014
     
    Posted By: maryyugo
    At 25 thousand feet, if you depressurize you will be _out_ in thirty or 40 seconds.
    If you don't breathe. Perhaps quicker if you do because it washes out the oxygen in your lungs.


    I think it would be impossible to hold your breath against any significant pressure differential- possibly even dangerous to try.
    •  
      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeSep 6th 2014
     
    It's certainly possible - it's one of the ways to kill yourself SCUBA diving.
    •  
      CommentAuthoralsetalokin
    • CommentTimeSep 10th 2014 edited
     
    •  
      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeSep 10th 2014 edited
     
    Posted By: tinker
    Posted By: maryyugo
    At 25 thousand feet, if you depressurize you will be _out_ in thirty or 40 seconds.
    If you don't breathe. Perhaps quicker if you do because it washes out the oxygen in your lungs.


    I think it would be impossible to hold your breath against any significant pressure differential- possibly even dangerous to try.


    Here is the story on lung damage due to decompression in aircraft:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncontrolled_decompression

    In this instance, it was probably slow to intermediate because the pilot had plenty of time to co0mmunicate, though badly, with ATC and request a lower altitude. He should have declared on emergency and descended even before clearance but he didn't and the rest is history. I suppose the inquiry will determine why not. Maybe.

    Anyway, given a modest speed of decompression, as in an altitude chamber exercise, the partial pressure of oxygen becomes very low but the overall air pressure rapidly equilibrates, particularly if the person is breathing at all.

    Posted By: AngusIt's certainly possible - it's one of the ways to kill yourself SCUBA diving.


    Oh yes, all too possible. Closing the glottis is enough to prevent air escaping and allows the pressure differential to build to lung-rupturing force. But that is not what happened in this incident as per the ATC tapes.

    From personal experience, when actively breathing with an oxygen mask at 35,000 feet simulated altitude, when you remove your mask, you have about 20 - 30 seconds of consciousness. And ABSOLUTELY no warning. No shortness of breath, NOTHING. The rarified chamber air feels fine. Different people can react differently. My particular sudden event was first, constriction of visual fields to a narrow central spot of vision with gray fuzz everywhere else. This was followed within 5 seconds with a focal motor seizure of the hands. I could not replace the mask. If the instructor had not done so for me, I would have been rapidly dead. Some others in the class simply went unconscious and flopped over. Others just stared. Obviously, the situation was rapidly corrected by the instructors as soon as anyone had symptoms.

    ETA: altitude chamber training http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypobaric_chamber
    •  
      CommentAuthorAngus
    • CommentTimeSep 10th 2014
     
    Once upon a time there was a ground attack aircraft that made a related sound by intention - the Ju-87.
    •  
      CommentAuthormaryyugo
    • CommentTimeSep 10th 2014
     
    The S3's on approach had a distinctive "whoop" sound.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FRJfBW_GQI